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R56 Cold Start Engine Sound

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Jasper View Drop Down
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Jasper Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Topic: R56 Cold Start Engine Sound
    Posted: March/06/10 at 6:22pm
Hi,

Has anyone in the area suffered from the R56 cold start issue?  My 07 MCS w/JCW use to have that "manly" sound in the morning, now when I start it up I occasionally get a lawn mower sound until the car warms up (loud rattling sound).  

Since its not consistent I tried to ignore it by humming engine sounds and/or turning my radio higher but my wife is starting to think I've gone nuts - time to have it fixed.  

If you had the cold start issue, was it a painless fix?  Did you have to leave your car there overnight to prove the strange sound to them in the morning?  Or did NW/Seattle MINI know what the problem was right away and fix it?  I'm reading mixed reviews on other dealerships across the US who tried to ignore the problem.  

Thanks,
Jasper
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote johnf36 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: March/07/10 at 2:46am
Both Seattle Mini and NW Mini are doing the upgrade. You need to call ad have them do the fix for you.

Just call Rachel at Seattle Mini and tell her you have the Death Rattle problem and you did not buy a Diesel.


John

http://www.motoringalliance.com/forums/mini-news/594-mini-solves-r56-cold-start-issue.html

http://www.motoringfile.com/2008/07/07/r56-cold-start-official-fix-coming/

http://www.northamericanmotoring.com/forums/factory-jcw-talk-2009/183378-death-rattle-fixed-finally.html 

Edited by johnf36 - March/07/10 at 2:57am
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Jasper Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: March/07/10 at 8:59am
Thanks for the info.  I made an appointment with Seattle Mini for later this week.  

Do you recall how long they took to fix your car?  I didn't speak directly to the service department, they just told me to bring it in for them to look at.  

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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Wildfamily Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: March/07/10 at 10:12am
We had to take our car in last week when the check engine light came on..was running a little rough in the morning when cold, but not the "death rattle". We had experienced a slight "death rattle" a couple of times over the last year, but not enought to warrant taking it in. While it was in the shop last week they had a heck of a time diagnosing what was causeing the miss-fire. Eventually, they did replace the timing belt and upgraded the tensioner among some other things and finally were able to get rid of the miss-fire. So good news is the "death rattle" has been taken care of along with the miss-fire. Bummer though...upon start-up this morning the check engine light came on again...so back to the shop on Monday I guess. I will say though that Seattle MINI has been very good and are working hard to figure out the problem. Regarding the timing chain/tensioner fix, it's a day in the shop. If it's persistant I would bring it to their attention.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote nicknbecka Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: March/07/10 at 11:24am
Now that it's a more widely-known problem with a known fix, I don't imagine you'd have any problems getting them to make the repair. Earlier (as in my case) the problem was much less clear and getting the correct fix involved multiple trips to the dealer to try increasingly progressive fixes.

It does need to stay overnight for them to be able to confirm the rattle- once the car has been run for a little bit, it purges the air bubble in the timing chain tensioner and the rattle goes away, so they'll need to be the first ones to start it after it's sat for a few hours.

The repair time shouldn't be more than a day, but I did have to wait a week since the shop was busy with lots of repairs. They did give me a loaner for the whole time, though.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote johnf36 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: March/07/10 at 12:03pm
I have a first Gen, so I don't hat that problem. I was going to say the Wilds and Boomer are a couple , and I see nicknbeca jumped in here too, I believe there are more that have had this problem addressed.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote johnf36 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: March/09/10 at 11:59pm
If everything seems under control, you're just not going fast enough.

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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Boomer Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: March/10/10 at 8:17am
Had both the "Death Rattle" and the oil accumulation problem. My car is a 07 MCS and when the oil accumulation problem happened I had less than 15,000 miles. Had to take this in several times before it was verified. Even set up a video camera to record the smoke and rough start.
 
Some little piss ant from Mini USA was in the shop when I took the recording to NW Mini and this guy was a first class A**HOLE. However, NW Mini was good and I emailed Mini USA on this little Napoleon.
 
They know about the issue, in fact both issues, and will work with you on a fix. Seattle Mini, Kyle is a great guy and appears to care about their customers and our great little cars. Just try to give them as much information as possible about the problem and go through your service advisor.
 
Be prepared to leave the car. It's a big job!
 
Cheers!
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Jasper Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: March/10/10 at 12:18pm
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Jasper Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: March/10/10 at 12:19pm
Thanks for all of the info.  

Spoke to Raychel at Seattle Mini, she's working with me to bring the car in and setting me up with a loaner car - not sure if they want the car to stay overnight to verify the problem or if they are going to fix it.  Just like everyone else, NW/Seattle have always been extremely nice to me.  

I'm hoping I don't have to go to extremes and make a video to prove it as I have no self control, I'd post it on youtube and rant (a lot) about how unhappy I'd be.  Then, I'd be one of those people....

Thanks,
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote johnf36 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: March/10/10 at 1:19pm
Cool Thumbs UpThumbs Up
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Habanero Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: March/23/10 at 6:08pm
Habanero goes in to NW MINI on Thursday for the same noise.  He gets rattley about every 2nd or 3rd  morning.  To hear metal clanging on metal is about as much fun as hearing fingernails on a chalkboard.  We'll see.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Jasper Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: March/23/10 at 6:24pm
Seattle MINI did the fix last week.  Rather painless, had to leave the car there in the afternoon so they could work on the car the following morning.  Gave me a loaner, I was snickering about the color - red with white top/stripes and white mirror caps...  Too cute for my taste but it got me around town.    

The fix involved a chain not being tight enough and it was rubbing up against something when I first start the car up.  They replaced it and I haven't had a cold start issue since the fix.  

Can't imagine NW MINI giving Habanero grief about the fix. 

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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Habanero Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: March/30/10 at 5:46pm
Habanero went through the full replacement in one day.  Terry was great, as always.
 
Apparently there are two ways to fix this: The chain tensioner is the culprit.  If the tensioner is bad, and the chains are OK, they just replace the tensioner.  If the chains have stretched, then they do the whole kit, rails and all. 
 
I should have asked the all-important question, and didn't - "Is the tensioner a design improvement?"  Anybody know??
 


Edited by Habanero - March/30/10 at 5:47pm
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote nicknbecka Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: March/30/10 at 9:22pm
Yep- It's been through a couple design changes, this third version seems to be holding up well for everyone. I've added a good 50,000 miles since mine was replaced without any cold-start rattle so far.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Habanero Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: March/31/10 at 3:01pm
Thanks, helps me breathe a little easier before pushing the start button.  Thumbs Up
 
Oh yeah --  before the replacement I thought Habanero had a little turbo lag/surge.  In retrospect, not so!  After the repair, there's no lag at all, just smooth power.  Could it be that the chains were actually stretched enough to affect the timing??  Yikes!!
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote nicknbecka Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: March/31/10 at 9:52pm
I know the feeling! Smile

I also noticed the same improvement for power, but my timing chain was also stretched enough to need the entire system replaced.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Jasper Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: December/07/10 at 1:08pm
About 8 months later the noise came back.  Good news is Seattle MINI is all over it and fixing it, something about pistons got bent this time.  

They gave me a NICE loaner this time, 2011 MINI S convertible.  I have to admit driving with the top down when its 40 degrees is pretty fun...      

I searched online and there is talk MINI found a permanent fix, can anyone confirm?

Title of the article makes me cringe ("again?")
http://www.motoringfile.com/2010/01/15/mini-solves-the-cold-start-problem-again/

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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote CORNERS Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: December/08/10 at 1:04am
Bent pistons? Wow. Stretched chain? I guess that could have happened if there was sufficient timing lag that engine parts are getting in the way of each other. 

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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Jasper Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: December/08/10 at 8:48am
I was told somehow chains stretched and after that the pistons made contact resulting in damage.  The chains were replaced during the first fix.    

I'm hoping the fix is more permanent, my warranty expires soon.  The idea of a new 2012 MINI is growing on me but if I continue to have problems I'm inclined to join the dark side and get pretentious - buy a Porsche or something more flashy.  

Jasper 
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote CORNERS Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: December/08/10 at 8:50am
Oh, I don't think you need to do anything that 'rash' - Get a Gen 1 R53 instead! 
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Jasper Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: January/08/11 at 7:59pm
Sadly I think I'm going to leave the MINI community.  I'm still having issues and its gotten to a point where the car can't be driven.  The engine malfunction light turned on and I couldn't go any faster than 10 miles per hour.     

I understand things happen but...  I called MINI roadside assistance and waited about two hours for a tow truck - which never showed.  Thankfully I was raised by a pack of wolves so I knew how to get my expensive paper weight to the dealer for them to look at.  

Maybe my expectations are too high but I've lost faith in MINI.  Leaving me to sit on the side of the street for two hours in the cold is just wrong.    


Edited by Jasper - January/08/11 at 8:01pm
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote catlvr2 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: January/08/11 at 11:02pm
Wow, that is really sad news!  I'm so sorry that you had such a negative experience!  Maybe someday you might decide to give MINI another try.  I've had 3 now and I've loved every one of them.  The only reason I get rid of each one of them was because I desired a newer one with the newer technology that goes with the newer ones.  But it sounds like you somehow wound up with the really bad deal.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote tyintegra Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: January/09/11 at 7:20am

I agree that you shouldn't leave the community, instead you should get a 2006 MCS instead. You could trade your car in on one and have a bunch of money left over. We have had our 2006 MCS for a year now and have had no problems what so ever. It also might be worth looking in to the lemon laws for your car, cause maybe you just got a really bad one. Also, you mentioned possible getting a Porsche, a friend of mine got a brand new GT3 (I think 2009 or 2010) and it just happened to be a "bad one" and he ended up having to turned it back in under the Lemon Laws. I am just saying that any individual car can be a Lemon but you can't completely right off the entire brand because of that one car. Just something to think about while you make your final decision.



Edited by tyintegra - January/09/11 at 7:22am
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Jasper Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: January/09/11 at 8:13am
I'm not necessarily annoyed about the car having issues.  Whether its a Porsche or a Hyundai, I can see a car will eventually break down.  

But what I find difficult to accept is MINI roadside assistance leaving me to fend for myself when I was instructed to call them for help.  I literally sat on the side of the road in Lynnwood for about two hours after calling them.  Only after calling a second time to ask if anyone was coming I was told the tow truck would be another 45 minutes.  

You could say the tow truck is dispatched by a third party but the roadside assistance is branded "MINI" - so I was expecting not to be left to fend for myself.  I paid a premium for a cool car but I suspect if I bought a Hyundai and it broke down I wouldn't be left waiting for a tow truck that never came.

Like I said, at the very least they shouldn't be leaving me out in the cold, what if the car broke down in a "bad part" of town or on a high traffic freeway.    

Jasper   


Edited by Jasper - January/09/11 at 8:15am
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote It's-a-MINI! Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: January/09/11 at 9:07am
I, too am sorry to see you go. I do have to tell you that a friend waited last winter on I5 for 5 hours for AAA when her Cadillac broke down.
On a trip to take our boat back to Lake Havasu we had a flat tire on our triple axel trailer, we have USAA, a Mercedes Sedan was dispatched with a 3 ton jack in the trunk, that was a joke, we sent him on his way & had to wait for a tow truck to be dispatched with the 6 ton jack we needed, we ended up staying in Bakersfield in a dive as by then it was late, pouring down rain with flooding, windy & no replacement tire available as that was our 2nd flat the first in Sacramento on a different tire. We now have a different brand and 2 spares.


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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote TWIZZLR Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: January/09/11 at 12:12pm
Originally posted by tyintegra tyintegra wrote:

... instead you should get a 2006 MCS instead. You could trade your car in on one and have a bunch of money left over. We have had our 2006 MCS for a year now ...


I know of an 06 MCS with 43K miles that was traded. BRG with a silver top and silver stripe. Well loved and taken care of. 

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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote catlvr2 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: January/09/11 at 2:32pm
Unfortunately (or maybe I should say fortunately) I've never had to use MINI roadside assistance so I can't speak from any experience.  That is a pretty rotten deal to be left hanging though.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote johnf36 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: January/10/11 at 3:03am
Something that is being missed here and the long time members know, PS Mini has a phone tree and the website is watched hourly for people that have problems. I know there is all kinds of services out there but none matches those that watch out for ourselves. This really came about the first year the club ran to AMVIV. If you are broke down in the state of Washington and can make a post to the club website we can find you and get you help.

Jasper  PS Mini is also here to provide a link to the real world when corporate America doesn't care. All you have to do is get a post out and in most cases a club member will show up for support and help. At one time we had a calling tree for the state, and alot of us have contacts in other states to help stranded Mini owners.

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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote It's-a-MINI! Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: January/10/11 at 12:33pm
I would bet that any Road Side Assistance is provided by a 3rd party contract.  It's the squeaky wheel that gets the grease.  I would have been on the phone after the 1st hour of waiting!!!!
Pat


Edited by It's-a-MINI! - January/10/11 at 12:33pm


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